[SlimDevices: Audiophiles] AudioQuest's Casablanca moment

[ralphpnj]

At the end of last month AudioQuest had Casablanca moment as true nature
of their ongoing business model was exposed for the fraud that it has
always been.

The whole tail of woe and deceit can be explored by following these
links:

And they're off: http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=5540

Bill Low responses:
http://www.stereophile.com/content/open-letter-bill-low-audioquest#MYE8MY5eSKRgJrIa.97
(the real fun is in the comments section and please note my comment
under the name "jazzfan" which is on page 4 of the comments)

RealhdD-audio fires back: http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=5561

And then brings in reinforcements: http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=5565

A note to Bill Low: when you play with fire you often get burned.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
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[Julf]

Unfortunately facts tend to be useless against faith.



"To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this
fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt
edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953
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[garym]

'AudioQuest's Casablanca moment'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?105173-AudioQuest-s-Casablanca-moment)
I just get a warm feeling from the thread title itself. Sadly, most of
the millennials I interact with wouldn't get the meaning.



*Home:* VortexBox 4TB (2.3) > LMS 7.8 > Transporter, Touch, Boom, Radio
(all ethernet)
*Cottage:* VBA 3TB (2.3) > LMS 7.8 > Touch > Benchmark DAC I, Boom,
Radio w/Battery (all ethernet except Radio)
*Office:* Win8(64) > LMS 7.9 > Squeezelite
*Spares:* Touch(3), Radio(3), Boom, SB3, CONTROLLER
*Controllers:* iPhone6 & iPadAir2 (iPeng8 & Squeezepad), CONTROLLER, or
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*Files:* ripping: dbpoweramp > FLAC; post-rip: mp3tag, PerfectTunes;
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[ralphpnj]

Post by garym
'AudioQuest's Casablanca moment'
(http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?105173-AudioQuest-s-Casablanca-moment)
I just get a warm feeling from the thread title itself. Sadly, most of
the millennials I interact with wouldn't get the meaning.

And they also don't understand why some people are still trying to find
where Jimmy Hoffa is buried. I guess that makes us (well at least me)
old.

Speaking of old, it seems that ripping audiophiles off never gets old.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
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Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
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[garym]

Post by ralphpnj
Speaking of old, it seems that ripping audiophiles off never gets old.

Sadly true.



*Home:* VortexBox 4TB (2.3) > LMS 7.8 > Transporter, Touch, Boom, Radio
(all ethernet)
*Cottage:* VBA 3TB (2.3) > LMS 7.8 > Touch > Benchmark DAC I, Boom,
Radio w/Battery (all ethernet except Radio)
*Office:* Win8(64) > LMS 7.9 > Squeezelite
*Spares:* Touch(3), Radio(3), Boom, SB3, CONTROLLER
*Controllers:* iPhone6 & iPadAir2 (iPeng8 & Squeezepad), CONTROLLER, or
SqueezePlay 7.8 on Win7(64) laptop
*Files:* ripping: dbpoweramp > FLAC; post-rip: mp3tag, PerfectTunes;
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[audiomuze]

Speaking of old, it seems that ripping audiophiles off never gets old.I think you mean audiophools.

SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.
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[ralphpnj]

Post by Julf
Unfortunately facts tend to be useless against faith.

I think that it's more like facts just get in the way of making money.

Post by Julf
I think you mean audiophools.

No I really do mean audiophiles and NOT audiophools since I don't
believe that audiophiles are fools. I believe that the vast majority of
audiophiles have been fooled into believing so much nonsense by a very
complex system that is working very hard to separate them from their
money.

Both the manufacturers and their handmaidens in the media have developed
a very good method to turn unscientific nonsense and pure opinion into
well respected "facts". The objective science side of audio playback and
measurement has been discarded in favor of the subjective opinion side
of audio listening, thus allowing for unscientific nonsense to become
facts.

For example, the whole anti-jitter craze was helped along by some
"respected" audio guru claiming to clearly hear jitter, which is well
known to be impossible by the human auditory system (ears and brains).
Now instead of the audio press simply stating this and therefore
discrediting or a least disregarding the opinion of this audio guru,
what happened was just the opposite - this unscientific nonsense became
an audiophile fact - humans can hear jitter. And once this bogus "fact"
was established the whole anti-jitter craze was born and lots of well
intending audiophiles has been happily separated from their money.

In the US the automobile industry uses JD Powers awards in much the same
way, i.e. the manufacturers pay JD Powers for an award and then they
advertise how they "earned" a JD Powers award. Since most consumers
don't realize that the JD Powers awards were purchased and not earned,
the system works quite well.

In the world of high end audio the manufacturer makes some outrageous
claim, such as the Audioquest Jitterbug device really works, and the
audio press loudly declares the device to be a sonic marvel and even
gives it all kinds of awards. These awards then show up in the
manufacturer's advertisements. Again this little system works quite
well.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
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Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
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[audiomuze]

far as I'm concerned people that fall victim to that nonsense are
audiophools, seemingly incapable of exercising critical thinking.



SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.
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[Julf]

Post by audiomuze
far as I'm concerned people that fall victim to that nonsense are
audiophools, seemingly incapable of exercising critical thinking.

Not true. They are definitely very critical against any criticism.
Confirmation and group bias are rather strong influences.



"To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this
fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt
edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953
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[Mnyb]

I think the audiophile culture actually traps some reasonable people now
and then . Its not hard to see why 99% of the so called "information"
the audiophile can enjoy in magazines and online is of very questinable
quality . I never seen any other hobby where almost all "knowledge" is
totally bogus and every magazine or forum or blog feeds you 99% nonsense
and lies . If you then does not have any enginnering background or
otherwise experienced in critical thinking ? I may not be easy to see
trough this.



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Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x
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sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
Misc use: Radio (with battery)
iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
(spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller )
server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

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[ralphpnj]

Post by Mnyb
I think the audiophile culture actually traps some reasonable people now
and then . Its not hard to see why 99% of the so called "information"
the audiophile can enjoy in magazines and online is of very questinable
quality . I never seen any other hobby where almost all "knowledge" is
totally bogus and every magazine or forum or blog feeds you 99% nonsense
and lies . If you then does not have any enginnering background or
otherwise experienced in critical thinking ? I may not be easy to see
trough this.

I can name another group where 99% of the "information" and"knowledge"
is just nonsense and lies - The US Republican party. Just a tad bit more
important than high end audio, although the Republicans do follow almost
the exact playbook as high end audio.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
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[Julf]

Post by ralphpnj
I can name another group where 99% of the "information" and"knowledge"
is just nonsense and lies - The US Republican party. Just a tad bit more
important than high end audio, although the Republicans do follow almost
the exact playbook as high end audio.

Not going to touch the politics with a 3-metre pole, but I think what we
are seeing in high end audio, politics, health fads etc. is actually
rejection of science and escapism - into "my opinion is just as valid as
that of all those fancy PhDs".



"To try to judge the real from the false will always be hard. In this
fast-growing art of 'high fidelity' the quackery will bear a solid gilt
edge that will fool many people" - Paul W Klipsch, 1953
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[cliveb]

Post by ralphpnj
No I really do mean audiophiles and NOT audiophools since I don't
believe that audiophiles are fools. I believe that the vast majority of
audiophiles have been fooled into believing so much nonsense by a very
complex system that is working very hard to separate them from their
money.

The way you phrase it implies that the conspiracy is being perpetrated
by organisations and individuals who have full knowledge that they are
lying and it is all nonsense.

But I think that the vast majority of high-end audio manufacturers
actually believe their own propaganda.
Which in a way is even more shocking: the vendors of items of
engineering don't actually understand the engineering they are
delivering.

Keep in mind Hanlon's razor: "never ascribe to malice that which can be
explained by stupidity"?



Transporter -> ATC SCM100A
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[arnyk]

Post by cliveb
The way you phrase it implies that the conspiracy is being perpetrated
by organisations and individuals who have full knowledge that they are
lying and it is all nonsense.
But I think that the vast majority of high-end audio manufacturers
actually believe their own propaganda.
Which in a way is even more shocking: the vendors of items of
engineering don't actually understand the engineering they are
delivering.
Keep in mind Hanlon's razor: "never ascribe to malice that which can be
explained by stupidity"?

Current understandings of perception and memory suggest that initially
these people may have been well-tutored in the basics, and knew them
very well. However, years of success with we might call "Alternative
wisdom" has literally changed their minds. The name John Atkinson
somehow comes to mind. ;-)


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[ralphpnj]

Post by Julf
Not going to touch the politics with a 3-metre pole, but I think what we
are seeing in high end audio, politics, health fads etc. is actually
rejection of science and escapism - into "my opinion is just as valid as
that of all those fancy PhDs".

I agree and therefore apologize for my lapse into politics. However I
don't think of it as a rejection of science but rather a rejection of
any science which gets in the way of profits, which is why Al Gore used
the label "An Inconvenient Truth".

Post by Julf
The way you phrase it implies that the conspiracy is being perpetrated
by organisations and individuals who have full knowledge that they are
lying and it is all nonsense.
But I think that the vast majority of high-end audio manufacturers
actually believe their own propaganda.
Which in a way is even more shocking: the vendors of items of
engineering don't actually understand the engineering they are
delivering.
Keep in mind Hanlon's razor: "never ascribe to malice that which can be
explained by stupidity"?

I believe that most high end audio engineers and designers fully
understand the science of audio but they are only a small part of the
team that make up a high end audio manufacturer. It's the marketing
people and others who are directing these engineers into the world of
voodoo science. For example I believe that the engineering team which
developed Audioquest's Jitterbug know full well that it's a complete
waste of money but that money is paying their salaries.

Post by Julf
Current understandings of perception and memory suggest that initially
these people may have been well-tutored in the basics, and knew them
very well. However, years of success with we might call "Alternative
wisdom" has literally changed their minds. The name John Atkinson
somehow comes to mind. ;-)

Even hinting that John Atkinson (or for that matter Robert Harley) has
or ever had any understanding of the basics of audio engineering is
completely laughable and an insult to all engineers, not just audio
engineers. They are both plain and simply shills for their advertisers.
Giving them even the slightest hint of respectability is exactly how
they are able to succeed. I much prefer to call them what they really
are - people who lie for money.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
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[Wombat]

I see some audio engineers really can measure or demonstrate technical
differences. These things are often far, far from being audible but are
taken as proof.
The bad thing is that exactly this creates audiophils that are
absolutely rational to other aspects of live but when it comes to audio
their imagination gets tricked only because they believe in it.


@arnyk
Nice to see you and i hope you are fine. Very few posts of yours lately.



Transporter (modded) -> RG142 -> Avantgarde Acoustic based 500VA
monoblocks -> Sommer SPK240 -> self-made speakers
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[ralphpnj]

Post by Wombat
I see some audio engineers really can measure or demonstrate technical
differences. These things are often far, far from being audible but are
taken as proof.
The bad thing is that exactly this creates audiophils that are
absolutely rational to other aspects of live but when it comes to audio
their imagination gets tricked only because they believe in it.
@arnyk
Nice to see you and i hope you are fine. Very few posts of yours lately.

I've said it many times before that measurements and high end audio work
two ways:

1) measurements are given as proof that A must sound better than B. For
example A has measurable (but still not audible) jitter and B has even
less (lower) jitter. Or A is a standard resolution file (24 bit and
44.1kHz) and B is a high resolution file (24bit and 96kHz)

2) measurements cannot show why A sounds so good. This argument is
ALWAYS used for ALL tube equipment and ALL vinyl playback equipment.

Remember when money is involved, and money is always the primary driver
in all things high end audio, hypocrisy has no bounds.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
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[audiomuze]

...in all things high end audio, hypocrisy has no bounds.agreed, and it's surpassed only by stupidity.

SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.
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[ralphpnj]

agreed, and it's surpassed only by stupidity.

As a reformed audiophile I have to either disagree or take the fifth (
https://www.google.com/#newwindow=1&safe=off&q=take+the+fifth ). Often
times the answer to something is hiding in plain sight and all one needs
to do is connect the dots in the proper order.

Back in high school and college I learned how to read equipment
specifications and then learned how to really read specs and began to
see what the manufacturer was trying to hide. My growing distrust of
mass market audio moved me towards high end audio, albeit at the "most
bang for the buck" end of things, and once again I had to relearn how to
specs, which for the most part are badly misused in high end audio, in
fact way more than in mass market audio. And then along came computer
based digital audio and audio equipment, especially front ends, became
more about proper/pure fidelity and less about euphonic coloration. And
as I slowly started connecting the dots, I came to distrust much of what
is written in the high end audio media. I still understand the need for
something better than mass market audio but with today's rapidly rising
prices it's more important than ever to find audio equipment that offers
great value for the money. Such as the Squeezebox Touch, the best $300 I
ever spent on a piece of audio equipment.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/jazzfann/)
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[audiomuze]

Take cables ... a fool and their money are soon parted.



SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.
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[TimT]

Post by audiomuze
Take cables ... a fool and their money are soon parted.

Perhaps. Consider this: John Audiophile has just dropped $15,000 on a
pair of speakers, $7500 on amplification and playback. What
interconnects does he buy? $15 for a pair of 10-foot speaker cables? Or
does he spend $300 on a "name brand" pair? Maybe $300 won't buy him
better sound; but almost certainly, John A thinks, it won't buy him
worse sound. No question that John can afford to spend more. What would
you do? What does the "rational audiophile" do?


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[audiomuze]

Post by TimT
Perhaps. Consider this: John Audiophile has just dropped $15,000 on a
pair of speakers, $7500 on amplification and playback. What
interconnects does he buy? $15 for a pair of 10-foot speaker cables? Or
does he spend $300 on a "name brand" pair? Maybe $300 won't buy him
better sound; but almost certainly, John A thinks, it won't buy him
worse sound. No question that John can afford to spend more. What would
you do? What does the "rational audiophile" do?I'll answer i.r.o. what I did and have stayed with having dropped

$30,000 in 2004 money on a pair of active speakers and preamplifier. I
bought a run of Belden 1800F and as many Neutrik connectors as I needed
to make up interconnects from DAC to preamp and preamp to speakers, had
them made up and soldered using silver solder. Over the years I've had
many audiophiles through my place, many with exotic cable in hand to
prove I was missing something. After listening they've all left
disappointed.



SqueezeWand | 'Vivere DAC MKI'
(http://vivereaudio.com/post/2013/08/16/DAC-I-is-Born!.aspx) | 'ATC
SCA2'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/electronics/source-pre-amplifiers/sca2/)
| 'ATC SCM100ASLT'
(http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/hi-fi/loudspeakers/tower-series/scm100aslt/)

*'Linux finally gets a great audio tagger'
(http://www.ubuntugeek.com/linux-finally-gets-a-great-audio-tagger.html):
'puddletag' (http://puddletag.sourceforge.net/)* - now packaged in most
Linux distributions.
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[ralphpnj]

Post by TimT
Perhaps. Consider this: John Audiophile has just dropped $15,000 on a
pair of speakers, $7500 on amplification and playback. What
interconnects does he buy? $15 for a pair of 10-foot speaker cables? Or
does he spend $300 on a "name brand" pair? Maybe $300 won't buy him
better sound; but almost certainly, John A thinks, it won't buy him
worse sound. No question that John can afford to spend more. What would
you do? What does the "rational audiophile" do?

There are many brands of well made and very reasonably priced cables
available. Mr. Audiophile can safely buy any of these cables for his
system will no loss in fidelity. His total amount for all of the
necessary wires and cables in the system need not be more than $300 to
$500, depending on the length of the cables and wires. And that would
really be only of interconnects and speaker wire - no fancy USB cables
or power cords - both of which are completely fine with the stock
cables.

Added bonus: with all the money Mr. Audiophile saves he can buy
something very nice for Mrs. Audiophile and the WAF of his new audio
system will go way, way up!



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/jazzfann/)
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[TimT]

Post by ralphpnj
There are many brands of well made and very reasonably priced cables
available. Mr. Audiophile can safely buy any of these cables for his
system will no loss in fidelity. His total amount for all of the
necessary wires and cables in the system need not be more than $300 to
$500, depending on the length of the cables and wires. And that would
really be only of interconnects and speaker wire - no fancy USB cables
or power cords - both of which are completely fine with the stock
cables.
Added bonus: with all the money Mr. Audiophile saves he can buy
something very nice for Mrs. Audiophile and the WAF of his new audio
system will go way, way up!

That's my question: what does $300 to $500 for interconnects buy Mr. A?
If "higher-priced cables = better sound" is audio-voodoo, why should
John A spend $500? Why not spend $50?


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[Mnyb]

You can argue a bit for fit and finish and build Quality , i would not
go much further than bluejeancables these days .
How much cabling was it how long speaker cables if passive and are we
talking 5.1 with a bunch of hdmi cables thrown in ?

I would,not even consider aftermarket high end power cords nowadays
that's a real scam the ones delivered with your stuff are probably safer
and less of fire hazard and fits better , the stiffness and weight of
some aftermarket cords are probably not good considering the fit into
the inlet of your amp etc . I have DIY some power cords what you can
introduce are twisted pairs and screening but that's it possible some
cheap ferrit clamps ( you can buy those cheap in bulk to ). Bewildering
enough the cable brand flogged here have some "entry level " power cords
without the only features you can have :) they made up some of thier own
instead .

But I see the marketing potential so I like the 30$ argument too for
this reason , with a fairly complex rig like mine with over 14 power
cords 4 hdmi cables 12 spdiff cables 1 toslink 8 Ethernet cables 1
analog Rca ( for the sub ) and some of you have a bunch more stuff than
I do :) if I can be compelled to buy a little better than the free stuff
included it's a good sale with high margins for very little engineering
skills ( you buy already engineered cables in bulk ,dress it up a bit
fancy and ad several 1000% markup ).

I do like the DIY aproach with pro or installation cable . If you are
without soldering skills or crimping tools ( you should not solder
spdiff or video cable ) blue jean cable does it good it's basically DIY
on order with well selected engineere cables from a real cable brand
like Belden etc .



--------------------------------------------------------------------
Main hifi: Touch + CIA PS +MeridianG68J MeridianHD621 MeridianG98DH 2 x
MeridianDSP5200 MeridianDSP5200HC 2 xMeridianDSP3100 +Rel Stadium 3
sub.
Bedroom/Office: Boom
Kitchen: Touch + powered Fostex PM0.4
Misc use: Radio (with battery)
iPad1 with iPengHD & SqueezePad
(spares Touch, SB3, reciever ,controller )
server HP proliant micro server N36L with ClearOS Linux

http://people.xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html
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[arnyk]

Post by TimT
That's my question: what does $300 to $500 for interconnects buy Mr. A?
If "higher-priced cables = better sound" is audio-voodoo, why should
John A spend $500? Why not spend $50?

Well for one thing, aesthetics. $50 doesn't go as far with cables as it
used to, and if you get your system cost that low, you are talking about
some pretty utilitarian-looking stuff.

If you bought $15K/pair speakers more than what you may want to admit of
that went into the furniture aspect, so the visual impression your
cables make on visiting firemen is probably part of your goals.


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[ralphpnj]

Post by TimT
That's my question: what does $300 to $500 for interconnects buy Mr. A?
If "higher-priced cables = better sound" is audio-voodoo, why should
John A spend $500? Why not spend $50?

Let me correct a slight problem with your statement: "higher-priced
cables = better sound" is not really where the voodoo lies but rather it
is more complicated than that simple equation.

To understand where today's misunderstanding about cables comes from one
needs to go back to the origin of the high end cable industry. Back in
the early days of after market audio cables, these after market cables
were completing against the standard run of the mill freebie cables that
came bundled with just about every piece of audio equipment. Super cheap
and very poorly made, these freebie cables more often than not were the
cause of many problems people experienced with their audio systems as
the cables failed, whether by not making a good and solid connection
between equipment or because they simply started to fall apart or
because these did not minimum requirements for the equipment involved.
To add to the problem the replacement cables available in the local
electronics store were often no better than the freebie cables.

By introducing replacement cables which offered better connections and
solid construction and which met the minimum requirements for the
equipment involved the problems caused by those cheap freebie cables
were solved. It was less about how much better one system sounded and
more about how a poorly functioning part of one's system had been
improved.

Where things started to go off the rails was when some very clever
marketing person realized that if people were willing to actually buy
better functioning (not sounding) cables perhaps they could be made to
buy even more expensive cables in the hope of further improving the
sound of their audio system. And so the very profitable high end cable
business came to be.

The fallacy in high end cables is that while it may be true that
replacing cheap, poorly made and improperly functioning freebie cables
with well made and properly functioning cables will make an audio system
function (and therefore "sound") better, replacing these well made and
properly functioning cables with even more expensive cables does nothing
to 1) improve the functioning of an audio system and 2) does nothing to
improve the sound of an audio system.

Think of cable as piping in a water supply system. In an audio system
each piece of equipment represents a variable load but with a known
upper limit, much like a sink in that one can open the faucet just a
little or all the way. When opened all the way a maximum amount of water
will flow but that maximum amount is determined by the faucet and not
the piping supplying the faucet. Similar to a power amp - the amount of
current needed by the power amp is determined by the amp itself and not
by the power cord. Now if the pipe supplying the faucet is undersized
then the faucet will not be able to produce the maximum flow. But if the
pipe supplying the faucet is correctly sized then the faucet will able
to produce the maximum flow. Making the pipe supplying the faucet bigger
than the correctly sized piping will not enable the faucet to produce
more than it's inherent maximum flow. The same is true for audio
equipment (i.e. electrical flow) in that once the correct cable size is
reached any larger cable will not improve the system.

In objectivist terms this means that once a properly sized and
functioning cable is provided that's all that is needed. Unfortunately
when there is money to be made there is also plenty of dishonesty, such
as when some fancy USB cable is compared to USB cable that does not meet
the minimum required specifications, or when a $1000 cable is claimed to
sound better than a $50 cable - purely subjective and total nonsense.



Living Rm: Transporter-SimAudio pre/power amps-Vandersteen 3A Sign. &
sub
Home Theater: Touch-Marantz HTR-Energy Veritas 2.1 & Linn sub
Computer Rm: Touch-Headroom Desktop w/DAC-Aragon amp-Energy Veritas 2.1
& Energy sub
Bedroom: Touch-HR Desktop w/DAC-Audio Refinement amp-Energy Veritas 2.0
Guest Rm: Duet-Sony soundbar
Garage: SB3-JVC compact system
Controls: iPeng; SB Controller; Moose & Muso
Server: LMS 7.9 on dedicated windows 10 computer w/2 Drobos
'Last.fm' (http://www.last.fm/user/jazzfann/)
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